Talk:National Donut Day

The history section needs some help

This paragraph has conflicting dates first mentioning 1938 then WWI: 'National Doughnut Day started on June 7, 1938 when a young military doctor by the name of Morgan Pett was sent to a military base....This fund raiser was later joined with the Salvation Army. Soon after the US entrance into World War I in 1917, The Salvation Army sent a fact-finding mission to France. '— Preceding unsigned comment added by 108.222.69.134 (talk) 04:01, 7 May 2015 (UTC)

Not only are the dates conflicting, but the two persons mentioned, and the story itself has no sources. I can find no mention of either men, nor this story, that does not come from this page itself. The edits in question were added here - https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=National_Doughnut_Day&oldid=571846411

I have added the citation needed flag, but I wonder if we should revert the section entirely. Thoughts? Jjd13 (talk) 07:17, 27 May 2015 (UTC)

Earlier National Donut Day references

Are there any references of a National Donut Day from before 2009?

== This page should be semi-protected in advance of the media holiday due increased "media attention" as per http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:SILVERLOCK#Semi-protection.

I've just deleted much of this article as it was either unsubstantiated by the source provided or completely irrelevant to National Donut Day, which just seems to have sprung up out of nowhere. I checked the source and it contained no mention of a National Donut or Doughnut Day. To clarify, the earliest known reference I found to any National Doughnut Day was this very article. DeuceBigalowMD (talk) 18:12, 5 June 2009 (UTC)

Did you actually check the sources in the article? I don't think you did. The Salvation Army link for example is archived back to 2005 [1] although the earliest one of those I can pull up is 2007. An Amazon search on "national donut day" turns up (admittedly trivial mentions): Oh, Solo Mia! : The Hip Chick's Guide to Fun for One by Wendy Burt and Erin Kindberg (2001), Bad Girl's 2003 Engagement Calendar by Cameron Tuttle (2002), Surviving When Youre Home Alone: How To Avoid Being Grounded For Life (Sandy Silverthorne's Surviving) (2003), The Naughty Secretary Club: The Working Girl's Guide to Handmade Jewelry by Jennifer Perkins (2008). A Google News search pulls up quite a few stories by major media: [2]. At the moment the day is mentioned on the front pages of https://www.dunkindonuts.com/ http://www.lamars.com/ http://www.krispykreme.com/ (maybe others?); the references on those may be (?) gone tomorrow.

What was the thing about Oscar Wilde in your edit for? http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=National_Doughnut_Day&diff=294617838&oldid=294615048 72.224.107.186 (talk) 20:57, 5 June 2009 (UTC)

Yes of course I checked the sources. The Salvation Army link refers to a Salvation Army "Donut Day" in Chicago from 1938, but no mention of a National Donut Day. The book that was cited as a reference, "Those Extraordinary Women of World War", bares no mention of a National Donut Day or indeed any other type of Donut Day. Could you cite a page reference for it?. There is no evidence that National Dnout Day existed prior to 2009, although efforts are obviously being made to try to legitamize this bogus National Holiday. Reverting to previous edit. DeuceBigalowMD (talk) 16:29, 6 June 2009 (UTC)

In addition, the paragraph I removed referring to the term "doughboy", and the section concerning the women who (quite correctly) made doughnuts for the troops serving in WWI, were removed because they bore no mention or reference to a Donut Day of any sort, and only served to try to add weight to this made up National Holiday. Also, while I entitled this talk section, "Are there any references of a National Donut Day from before 2009?", the actual point of contention is whether National Donut Day can be traced back to 1937/38, as is claimed, and to what degree it actually aims to honor any brave women. I've spent more time looking for evidence of this holiday than I have altering the article, and quite simply, you can't find what isn't there. DeuceBigalowMD (talk) 16:53, 6 June 2009 (UTC)

I've just found a cached link on Internet Archive from 2006 that says that National Donut Day is always on the first Friday in June, so we can be sure it dates back that far at least http://web.archive.org/web/20060223120857/http://holidayinsights.com/moreholidays/June/doughnutday.htm although it's unfortunate that the site also puts 'Waffle-Iron Day' and 'Insurance Awareness Day' in the same month. I'm not sure how or whether to update the article with this information yet, in light of its apparent inconsistency with the history already given.DeuceBigalowMD (talk) 17:06, 6 June 2009 (UTC)

Yes, there are lots of references. Why don't you look for some and stop removing the citations added by others. It's been included in Chase's calendar of events going back to at least 1985. I don't know why you keep distorting this article and removing extensive content, but it's highly disruptive. ChildofMidnight (talk) 18:44, 12 June 2009 (UTC)

Agreed. Шизомби (talk) 12:20, 13 June 2009 (UTC)

I have checked every reference provided and searched extensively for evidence of National Donut Day prior to this year, without success. If you have been able to find a source, please cite it to back up your, as yet, unverified claims. If you say you've found one, why have you reverted my previous edit without citing your reference?

Again, large chunks of this article consist of irrelevant trivia which serves only to 'pad out' this bogus article. The section that explains the origins of the term 'doughboys', for example, has no direct connection to any kind of Donut Day or the women who the Salvation Army tried to honour with their (non-National) Donut Day.

Perhaps it would help if you were willing to distinguish between the Salvation Army's 'Donut Day' and the recent, unexplained 'National Donut Day' that began this year. If you had researched this thoroughly enough, you would be aware that they are clearly not the same. DeuceBigalowMD (talk) 17:00, 13 June 2009 (UTC)

Replied below. The dougboy bit appears to be a legitimate clarification on the origins and mythology related to that term. I haven't seen any sources suggesting this event was invented in 2009. Can you post them here? Let's keep the thread together in one place below. ChildofMidnight (talk) 01:59, 14 June 2009 (UTC)

image

Is this a free image we could use http://blogs.suntimes.com/shinyobjects/assets_c/2009/06/DoughnutGirl-8459.html? ChildofMidnight (talk) 17:57, 6 June 2009 (UTC)

Donut Day and National Donut Day

According to my research, Donut Day has existed since the 1930's and was a Salvation Army event aimed at remembering women from WWI who made donuts for the soldiers on the front line.

National Donut Day did not seem to exist prior to 2008, aside from one or two references on obscure websites and blogs.

These are two distinct events. The Salvation Army Donut Day never claimed to be anything more than a locally held fund-raising event for the Salvation Army. To distinguish between the two, I have created an article for Donut Day which describes its link to the Salvation Army and explains how long its been in existence. DeuceBigalowMD (talk) 17:15, 13 June 2009 (UTC)

I understand your point of view, but it appears to be based entirely on original research. Do you have any sources suggesting the events are unrelated or separate? Can you check Chase's calendar of events out from a library and see what they say on this holiday? If National Donut day was created in 2009, which I don't see any evidence for, perhaps the article should be made solely about Donut Day, a historic and notable event. But I don't see any evidence that suggests they don't have anything to do with one another. ChildofMidnight (talk) 01:57, 14 June 2009 (UTC)

It's unfortunate that you've reverted against consensus to a version that two editors have opposed. You haven't provided any sources for your assertions here or in the article and you've removed sources added by others. You've also added a link to Donut Day that links to back to this article. Your actions are not helpful at all. ChildofMidnight (talk) 02:03, 14 June 2009 (UTC)

I believe I have addressed every one of your objections based on my research conducted on the references given in each edit of the article. Whenever I have reverted an edit, I have clearly explained my reasons for doing so. There is no evidence that the Salvation Army have ever held a National Donut Day, so any attempts to link their Donut Day (which goes back to 1938) to National Donut Day (which seemed to begin this year) need to be backed up with proof. Here is a link to an online copy of Chase's. Can you cite a page reference and tell me which edition you are referring to? Chase's 2009 link DeuceBigalowMD (talk) 19:28, 14 June 2009 (UTC)

Please don't ignore my concerns. You still haven't provided any citations for your edits nor any evidence that the holiday was invented in 2009. If it was, notability for that holiday would be a serious concern. If you want to move the article to Donut Day, that's okay with me. But please stop removing citations and sourced content in favor of your original research and theories. Donut Day is mentioned in numerous prior editions of Chase's Calendar of Events. You can search for them on google books, but I don't think a preview is available. ChildofMidnight (talk) 20:47, 14 June 2009 (UTC)

Here is a link to Chase's Calendar of Events 2009 on Google Books. I can find no mention of Donut Day or National Donut Day in there. There is proof that National Donut Day has existed since 2009. Until we can find proof that it predates this, we cannot reliably claim it does. DeuceBigalowMD (talk) 19:51, 16 June 2009 (UTC)

Deuce, what does that source establish? You haven't provided any evidence for your theory about when the holiday was established or any evidence that National Donut Day isn't connected to Donut Day. Content is based on what sources say, not on your interpretations and theories. THere are lost of sources that establish Donut Day going back to 1938 in a fundraising honoring WWI volunteer efforts. This material and the sources need to be restored. ChildofMidnight (talk) 23:29, 16 June 2009 (UTC)

ChildofMidnight, I'm beginning to think you're deliberately being difficult and evasive. I've provided a link to the source that you cited because you failed to do so. I did so to show that it verifies none of the claims that you've made, and which you still insist should remain in the article. I would suggest that you thoroughly re-read the comments on the discussion page to familiarize yourself with the issues being raised. DeuceBigalowMD (talk) 11:58, 17 June 2009 (UTC)

All the "claims" I've made about the history of Donut Day and the Salvation Army are sourced. Your assertion that National DOnut Day started in 2009 is completely unsourced OR. There's not even a hint anywhere in anything that this is the case. I've wasted enough time on this. It's obvious that you don't understand verifiability or the basis of citations to reliable sources that this encyclopedia is supposed to be based on. ChildofMidnight (talk) 17:38, 17 June 2009 (UTC)

Do you accept that Donut Day and National Donut Day are two separate events, created by two entirely different groups with entirely different motives, and many years apart? DeuceBigalowMD (talk) 14:31, 18 June 2009 (UTC)

Not unless you have a source that says that. I don't support saying they are connected or saying they are separate without a source. We can only write about what we can establish which is that there is a Salvation Army related event going back to 1938 and a National Donut Day. ChildofMidnight (talk) 18:16, 18 June 2009 (UTC)

With respect, your last comment both contradicts itself and appears to miss my point entirely. We have still not established a relationship between National Donut Day and the Salvation Army, or their Donut Day. To include any reference to the Salvation Army in this article would be to infer a relationship that we do not know exists. You claim to have found a reference in Chase's, yet I was unable to find any reference to it in the copy of Chase's I have access to, and you seem unable or unwilling to provide a page reference or state which edition you are referring to. It would be very helpful if you could provide this information. DeuceBigalowMD (talk) 01:49, 26 June 2009 (UTC)

On The Issue of Multiple Doughnut Days

There seems to be this June "National Donut Day" along with a November 5th "National Doughnut Day", both being distinct holidays, although the November event seems less celebrated . And the only reference I could find for the history behind a November doughnut day indicates it was invented by a US prisoner of war during the Vietnam War to get his captors to feed them doughnuts.. I feel the article should be updated to reflect these two holidays. 50.172.160.172 (talk) 22:17, 5 November 2014 (UTC)

References

Importance to the economy

In the paragraph added by @Claverhouse: that states that 756 doughnuts are eaten each year by each American, I believe a bad source of data was used. I don't believe every American eats 2 doughnuts every day, even on average. Huffington post reports that 10 billion doughnuts are made each year, and there are 326 million Americans, which would compute to 30 doughnuts per year for each American. That is a believable number. I believe the paragraph should be stricken and the reference removed, or rewritten with a more reliable data reference. --Pjameswiki (talk) 03:43, 26 May 2018 (UTC) Update - I believe I found the original source that was used by the Huffington Post author: http://www.rawfoodexplained.com/junk-foods/breaking-the-junk-food-addiction.html. Although it only says 1 dozen per week, so maybe it was lowered since the Huffington Post author used it, or maybe it was exaggerated. I don't see a source for that number, but the same page mentions the 1982 price for such items, so it is extremely out of date information and should be used in an 'importance to the economy' section. I'd stick to the more believable 10 billion doughnuts made each year.--Pjameswiki (talk) 04:05, 26 May 2018 (UTC)

Assessment comment

The comment(s) below were originally left at Talk:National Donut Day/Comments, and are posted here for posterity. Following several discussions in past years, these subpages are now deprecated. The comments may be irrelevant or outdated; if so, please feel free to remove this section.

I believe this article to be notable - it should definitely NOT be deleted. I was looking for information on Doughnut Day and Wikipedia, as usual, did not disappoint. Plath81 (talk) 15:07, 2 June 2009 (UTC)

Last edited at 15:08, 2 June 2009 (UTC). Substituted at 00:54, 30 April 2016 (UTC)

National donut day

I would like to know about the national donut day from Dunkin’ Donuts . 173.76.103.3 (talk) 22:41, 2 June 2022 (UTC)

Requested move 3 June 2022

The following is a closed discussion of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on the talk page. Editors desiring to contest the closing decision should consider a move review after discussing it on the closer's talk page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

The result of the move request was: Moved (closed by non-admin page mover) -- Vaulter 18:27, 11 June 2022 (UTC)

---

National Doughnut Day → National Donut Day – This appears to be the most common way of spelling the holiday by orders of magnitude:

• A search for "national donut day" returns 13,500,000 results on Google;
• A search for "national doughnut day" returns 256,000 results on Google.
• NGRAMS also shows similar dominance of "National Donut Day" over "National Doughnut Day", even when accounting for variations in capitalization.

Seeing as there is a clear and dominant WP:COMMONNAME, and the proposed name meets all of the WP:CRITERIA, this page should be moved to the common name. — Ⓜ️hawk10 (talk) 17:48, 3 June 2022 (UTC)

• Weak Support while donut is the common way to spell the word, the official holiday is National Doughnut Day. The AP style guide also prefers doughnut, and doughnut is listed in the dictionary. All that being said, I personally spell it donut, which is why I weak support.

[3] [4] Sheehanpg93 (talk) 18:59, 3 June 2022 (UTC)

• Support. WP:COMMONNAME. Showiecz (talk) 03:26, 4 June 2022 (UTC)
• Oppose Per doughnut, moving this page would go against WP:CONSISTENT. ᴢxᴄᴠʙɴᴍ (ᴛ) 07:19, 4 June 2022 (UTC)
• Support per overwhelming common usage. The official name does not count very much by comparison (it will of course be a redirect), and nor does the spelling of doughnut in other contexts. Andrewa (talk) 19:03, 10 June 2022 (UTC)
• Support Let's assume for the sake of argument that what the doughnut article says is true, and that "donut" is the American spelling and "doughnut" is international. This holiday is an American one, so WP:TIES should put it at Donut even if the article on the pastry stays at doughnut. WP:CONSIST explicitly lays out that consistency does not mean imposing one national variety of English over another. I donut see a reason to oppose. Red Slash 19:04, 10 June 2022 (UTC)
  • Well said. I donut think there is any dough-t. Andrewa (talk) 19:09, 10 June 2022 (UTC)

The discussion above is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.