Talk:Garuda Indonesia Flight 035

DC9s and thunderstorms...

...just don't mix.137.205.183.109 (talk) 11:25, 14 December 2015 (UTC)

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Requested move 28 December 2021

The following is a closed discussion of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on the talk page. Editors desiring to contest the closing decision should consider a move review after discussing it on the closer's talk page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

The result of the move request was: No consensus. After a month and a half, a clear consensus has yet to be established. This close does not preclude another RM from being opened sooner than the “general” 3 month waiting period. — Coffee // have a ☕️ // beans // 04:46, 13 February 2022 (UTC)

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• Garuda Indonesia Flight 708 → Garuda Indonesian Airways Flight 708
• Garuda Indonesia Flight 892 → Garuda Indonesian Airways Flight 892
• Garuda Indonesia Flight 150 → Garuda Indonesian Airways Flight 150
• Garuda Indonesia Flight 206 → Garuda Indonesian Airways Flight 206

– The name of the airline at the time was Garuda Indonesian Airways and not Garuda Indonesia. The former name should be used in this case as Garuda Indonesia didn't exist at the time. Username006 (talk) 04:37, 28 December 2021 (UTC)— Relisting. -- Aervanath (talk) 03:18, 11 January 2022 (UTC)— Relisting. — Coffee // have a ☕️ // beans // 22:44, 23 January 2022 (UTC)

Removing Garuda Indonesia Flight 035 as seeing through timetables, the airline changed its name in 1986 while the accident of flight 035 was in 1987. Username006 (talk) 13:12, 28 December 2021 (UTC)

• Oppose. The official name at the time of the incident is not of any great relevance. What is the common name in the most recent sources? Andrewa (talk) 06:24, 6 January 2022 (UTC)

@Andrewa: The name of the airline at the time of the accident should be used. And Garuda Indonesian Airways is the common name. See this similar move: [1] and this reliable source: [2]. The former name is relevant. Username006 (talk) 07:31, 7 January 2022 (UTC)

Thanks for the ping. Why do you think that Garuda Indonesian Airways is the common name? One occurrence is not enough to show this. The previous RM is indeed a precedent but I believe in error. Interesting! But in this case I could perhaps even make a case that the common name is just Garuda. Of course for the article on the airline that needs disambiguation, so we use the natural disambiguation for the airline article and it is at Garuda Indonesia. But for the first article in the RM list, for example, Garuda Flight 708 would be unambiguous. Even the Indonesia is unneeded. That suggests to me an alternative to this proposal. Food for thought? Andrewa (talk) 17:25, 7 January 2022 (UTC)

@Andrewa:Garuda Indonesian Airways was the former common name. But even then, every single name need not be a common name. It could have also been that the move was to JAL Flight 123 or JAL Flight 350 per WP:COMMONNAME. But per Template:R from short name, these are used as redirects. Garuda Flight 708 can also be taken but just because its shorter, doesn't instantly prove that it is more commonly used. These names are rather possibilities of names, sources could use. A good example would be Italiani Flight 12 where I'm too requesting a move to Aero Trasporti Italiani Flight 12. I'm conducting this request not only for consistency, but I can't find a single source referring to it as 'Italiani Flight 12' but rather 'Aero Trasporti Italiani Flight 12'. The most suitable name should also be used instead of primarily focusing on WP:COMMONNAME. That's also why we don't call Korean Air Lines Flight 007 as Korean Air Flight 007. Username006 (talk) 06:13, 8 January 2022 (UTC)

• Strong Support Logical that the page title should match the name of the airline at the time of the incident, and that matches coverage, not the name it has since changed to today. Usage in sources doesn't seem to show otherwise. The opposing argument is fairly nonsensical -- if we can find that the common name in sourcing refers to it as a different name for the airline that would be one thing, but barring that evidence we should obviously use the actual name of the airline involved in the incident. --Yaksar (let's chat) 00:25, 17 January 2022 (UTC)

The discussion above is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

Uzi, not MP5

The following is excerpt from Ken Conboy's book called "Kopassus, Inside Indonesia's Special Forces", page 282: "...Moerdani gathered the team around his desk and unveiled specialized equipment he had been stockpiling for special contingencies. This included silenced Israeli-made Uzi submachine guns, Beretta .22 caliber pistols, night vision googles, and half a dozen white commercial bulletproof vests". Conboy later on mentioned the MP5s at page 292: "From a generous initial budget approved by Moerdhani, they purchased some of the best counter-terrorist gear in the world. Assault rifles were the highly regarded Heckler and Koch MP5K from West Germany".149.108.99.108 (talk) 12:09, 27 November 2023 (UTC)

And the MP5K was introduced somewhere around 1982. 149.108.99.108 (talk) 12:11, 27 November 2023 (UTC)